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Thread: Another Trans Gendered Discussion

  1. #1

    Another Trans Gendered Discussion

    Transphobia is a misnomer. I'm not afraid of trans people, nor do I hate them. I just don't think that they deserve their own gender categories... no matter what they have done to their bodies surgically, they are still men and women like the rest of us. Not because I'm tyranically plotting their downfall, but because evolution really only gave human beings those two options.
    Spoon boy: Do not try and bend the Patriarchy. That's impossible. Instead... only try to realize the truth.
    Neo: What truth?
    Spoon boy: There is no Patriarchy.

    Apparently, women get only 77 cents for every dollar a man earns. We only have 23 cents left, but feminists insist they want the rest.

  2. #2

    RE: New Statesman claims that Movember is divisive, gender normative and racist

    Quote Originally Posted by MrAndryist
    Transphobia is a misnomer. I'm not afraid of trans people, nor do I hate them. I just don't think that they deserve their own gender categories... no matter what they have done to their bodies surgically, they are still men and women like the rest of us. Not because I'm tyranically plotting their downfall, but because evolution really only gave human beings those two options.
    So intersexuals, people with turner's syndrome, people with kleinfelter's syndrome, and genetic chimeras just don't exist, apparently.

  3. #3
    Senior Member comhcinc's Avatar
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    RE: New Statesman claims that Movember is divisive, gender normative and racist

    Quote Originally Posted by MrScruffles
    Quote Originally Posted by MrAndryist
    Transphobia is a misnomer. I'm not afraid of trans people, nor do I hate them. I just don't think that they deserve their own gender categories... no matter what they have done to their bodies surgically, they are still men and women like the rest of us. Not because I'm tyranically plotting their downfall, but because evolution really only gave human beings those two options.
    So intersexuals, people with turner's syndrome, people with kleinfelter's syndrome, and genetic chimeras just don't exist, apparently.
    He can't see them.



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  4. #4
    Senior Member Maxx's Avatar
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    RE: New Statesman claims that Movember is divisive, gender normative and racist

    Quote Originally Posted by MrScruffles
    Quote Originally Posted by MrAndryist
    Transphobia is a misnomer. I'm not afraid of trans people, nor do I hate them. I just don't think that they deserve their own gender categories... no matter what they have done to their bodies surgically, they are still men and women like the rest of us. Not because I'm tyranically plotting their downfall, but because evolution really only gave human beings those two options.
    So intersexuals, people with turner's syndrome, people with kleinfelter's syndrome, and genetic chimeras just don't exist, apparently.
    What have any of those syndromes got to do with trans people? They relate to having a combination of biological traits of BOTH genders due to physiological and genetic anomalies ...not having ALL the biological traits of one gender while expressing a desire to have ALL the biological traits of the other.
    "Being a cunt doesn't make you wrong." ComradePrescott

  5. #5

    RE: New Statesman claims that Movember is divisive, gender normative and racist

    Quote Originally Posted by MrScruffles
    Quote Originally Posted by MrAndryist
    Transphobia is a misnomer. I'm not afraid of trans people, nor do I hate them. I just don't think that they deserve their own gender categories... no matter what they have done to their bodies surgically, they are still men and women like the rest of us. Not because I'm tyranically plotting their downfall, but because evolution really only gave human beings those two options.
    So intersexuals, people with turner's syndrome, people with kleinfelter's syndrome, and genetic chimeras just don't exist, apparently.
    I fail to see the point you're trying to make.

  6. #6

    RE: New Statesman claims that Movember is divisive, gender normative and racist

    Quote Originally Posted by Maxx
    What have any of those syndromes got to do with trans people?
    The point that Mr. Andryist seemingly failed to understand is that gender is not just A or B. It is A or B for most people, but not all people.

    Quote Originally Posted by Maxx
    They relate to having a combination of biological traits of BOTH genders due to physiological and genetic anomalies ...not having ALL the biological traits of one gender while expressing a desire to have ALL the biological traits of the other.
    When it comes to trans people, they psychologically identify as a member of the other gender, even at a very young age.[1][2] And the brain is the most important part of your biology, needles to say, so no, transpeople do not have all the biological traits of one gender.

    [1] http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2211729/Transgender-Danann-Tyler-9-tried-cut-penis-craft-scissors.html
    [2] http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-514627/Boy-10-hangs-telling-mother-I-want-girl.html

  7. #7
    Senior Member Maxx's Avatar
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    RE: New Statesman claims that Movember is divisive, gender normative and racist

    Quote Originally Posted by MrScruffles

    When it comes to trans people, they psychologically identify as a member of the other gender, even at a very young age.[1][2] And the brain is the most important part of your biology, needles to say, so no, transpeople do not have all the biological traits of one gender.
    Apparently you don't know the difference between biological and psychological. Anyway this is a long and complex debate and this isn't the thread to have it in so I'll just leave it at that.

    Wanna get into this issue start another thread. Let's not derail this one.
    "Being a cunt doesn't make you wrong." ComradePrescott

  8. #8

    RE: New Statesman claims that Movember is divisive, gender normative and racist

    Quote Originally Posted by Maxx
    Apparently you don't know the difference between biological and psychological. Anyway this is a long and complex debate and this isn't the thread to have it in so I'll just leave it at that.
    Psychology=Biology. The brain controls the body, moods can affect your physical well-being and all that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Maxx
    Wanna get into this issue start another thread. Let's not derail this one.
    TO MODS: Please move posts 14-16 and 19-23 in this thread into a thread of its own.

  9. #9
    Administrator Grumpy Old Man's Avatar
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    RE: Another Trans Gendered Discussion

    Split post!

  10. #10

    RE: Another Trans Gendered Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by MrAndryist
    Transphobia is a misnomer. I'm not afraid of trans people, nor do I hate them. I just don't think that they deserve their own gender categories... no matter what they have done to their bodies surgically, they are still men and women like the rest of us. Not because I'm tyranically plotting their downfall, but because evolution really only gave human beings those two options.
    Clearly not, if we have transexuals. Would you say they didn't evolve along with the rest of us?

    I've always been of the side of removing the trans part in everyday convo and reference. When I talk to a transman friend, I say "hey man!", not "hey, transman!"

    However, they also do deserve some unique angle because obviously they are not born into their proper gender, or however you wish to phrase that. As such, a pre-op trans-woman going to get her prostate checked would definitely need to identify as a transwoman, or would be outed regardless.

    One of my transwoman colleagues was going for one such test and the "gatekeeper" was shocked, loud, and obnoxious in the typical ignorant fashion of "but you're a woman!" Or "you're a man!"? I forget exactly, but obviously trying to shove her into a gender binary in which she does not fit. Men don't like getting their prostate checked most of the time. Now imagine trying to get your checked (cause cancer, y'know) and that's the treatment you run into.
    [hr]
    However, on "transphobia", just like homophobia, I never like the term because it implies fear (which it sometimes is, fear of the unknown) and not hate (which it more often is).
    [hr]
    Quote Originally Posted by RustyJ
    I fail to see the point you're trying to make.
    He's pointing out that gender is not a binary, as the OP implied.

    There are more gender outcomes. The majority of us are born into your male/female bodies (and are usually comfortable in them) but some are born into what they feel are not the correct sex, and modern science allows them to change to match the gender society places on that sex. Some animals in nature can do this on their own without the need of science.

    In the case of intersex, what sex/gender would you place someone if they had both parts?

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