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Depression Isn’t Making Men Commit Suicide, Society Is

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  • Depression Isn’t Making Men Commit Suicide, Society Is

    Depression Isn’t Making Men Commit Suicide, Society Is
    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/adri..._11244826.html


    "Instead of believing that women HAVE problems and men ARE problems, we should be encouraging environments in which men feel comfortable enough to seek help for their problems."
    FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
    It's time to call it out for what it is.
    == REJECT FEMINISM. EMBRACE HUMANITY ==


    The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men
    http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

  • #2
    Comment string saved for posterity... For I fear a deletion is imminent.







    Don Anderson · New Brighton, Minnesota
    Honestly, I don't think MGTOW is the answer, but there is a concept I learned from my time in that community that I think is something that should be taught to boys and men in general.
    You have inherent value as a human being by virtue of being alive.
    You don't need to validate yourself through being in relationships. You don't need to validate yourself through whether you're getting laid or not. You don't need to validate yourself through what car you drive, or what house you live in, or what job you have. Validate yourself through yourself. Validate yourself through your accomplishments and who you are as a person.
    Probably the worst thing we do to boys and men is hang this ridiculous concept of "a real man" over their heads. You're not a "real man" unless you're living up to someone else's expectations of who you should be, and what you should be doing. We've all heard the idea that men and women are held to different standards, but do we ever really examine just how deep that rabbit hole goes? Just for example, men are most often told to "stop being childish" and "man up" and give up their dreams for something "more realistic". Also, there's almost a flat out denial of women hanging these standards over boys and mens' heads - it's all "the Patriarchy".
    That sort of double-standard and contradiction can drive a man insane. "I'm a strong, independent woman that makes my own money and don't need no man, and I'm all for smashing stereotypical gender roles...but I still want a man to be "traditional" and pay for dates and do other stereotypically "traditional" man things."
    Another example I like to use is the double-standard when it comes to cheating, and how, it seems, it's always the man's fault. What do you hear from people when a man cheats on a woman? "Well, he should have just kept it in his pants! He should have broken up with her, or, better yet, just stayed faithful!" What do you hear from people when a woman cheats on a man? "Well, I guess he just wasn't satisfying her wants/needs, so she went out and got it from someone who could give it to her! Man up next time, and maybe you won't get cheated on!"
    There is a whole laundry list of ways men's experiences, wants, needs, fears, and other things are discounted and pushed aside in favor of focusing on women. Women are afraid of being raped, as is evidenced by the current rape histeria on college campuses across the country, but when men express a fear of being falsely accused, they're laughed at, told their fears and feelings are irrational and stupid, and that they should focus on aleviating women's fears, which are far more important. This is often done by women. Then they turn around and express the desire for men to be able to express their emotions, and they blame "the Patriarchy" (a system created by men, apparently) for why men can't express themselves emotionally. Just examine that train of thought for a second.
    I wish you would express yourself emotionally, but when you express yourself emotionally your emotional expression is stupid and irrational, and it's your own fault you can't express your emotions. How is it so hard for so many people to see how that sort of logic could mess with someone's head?
    There's more I could say on the topic, but I don't want to write an article in response to an article (especially because I'm not on anyone's payroll).

    Like· Reply · · 2 August 2016 04:50




    Paolo Dolorosa · Senior Engineer at Weyland-Yutani Corporation
    You say MGTOW isn't the answer, but then go on to give a long list of reasons that make MGTOW look really apppealing.

    Like · Reply · · 3 August 2016 04:43









    Malcolm Newall· Queen's University
    Paolo Dolorosa Men should not say they must be MGTOW, but they must learn to not think they need to be in a relationship, that things are always their fault. They should be in a position where they can leave if things go south, with as much ease as their partner. Today that is not true in marriage, therefore... MGTOW is appealling. It does not mean it is the answer, but it may be a good course for now.

    Also men should stay aware of the imbalance, and be clear that they see it. If a woman wants you to pay, you should have questions. If she wants to get married, you should be asking, how you are equally secure etc. MGTOW is not the answer, but it is better than being pushed into a corner, where you have little recourse. Even a good person will be hard pressed to not take advantage, and one that is not aware in advance will never see themselves doing it. So maintain the balance.

    Like · Reply· · 3 August 2016 11:26









    Paolo Dolorosa · Senior Enginer at Weyland-Yutani Corporation
    Malcolm Newall Meh I'm not convinced. Sell it to me. What possible gains are there for me in marriage or a conventional relationship with a woman?

    Like · Reply 1 · 3 August 2016 12:33









    Gavan O'Sullivan· Perth, Australia
    Malcolm Newall Agreed. It is the answer for now. If things change and it becomes safe for a man to be in a relationship, then OK. But not for now.

    Like· Reply· · 3 August 2016 22:02









    Malcolm Newall · Queen's University
    Paolo Dolorosa It requires a rebalancing of the current rewards and penalties. That is my point, I do not believe MGTOW is the long term answer, and I do not buy that just because of evolutionary biology it is a losing proposition for men. Humans, all of them, respond to incentive systems, and today, there is little penalty to a woman seeking to try something new, when she thinks marriage is getting stale. She does really risk the kids, she does not really risk her financial well being (there are exceptions and men can do a better job of managing divorce, like not moving from your home etc). Too often women have been taught that it is always the man's fault, so when they are unhappy, they do not question the possibility that their commitment, or actions could be the problem. This environment makes a committed relationship for a man, a losing proposition, as he has the potential to lose, and is likely to end up facing a woman much less committed to making it work than he is.

    However, this reality has started to change behavior (in men) and that will have consequences. Younger women, are in general (notable exceptions) much more willing to look at the issues in the law, as they can see how it will affect them. They have seen too often angry jealous mothers, who initiated divorce, lose it when their ex moves on emotionally and try to use the kids to control his behavior, even though they were the ones who initiated the divorce. There is a dawning realization that the lack of balance is why they are struggling to find mates. There is in the younger generation a realization, that the Boomers, have not gotten past 1975, and still cannot see the impact of the changes to divorce laws that NOW drove and that these oddly have thrown relationships out of balance. The one thing that feminism has missed in all of the activism, and that is there was always 2 sides, the first sacrificed in society by male leaders were other men.

    Boomers forgot that their lives were formed largely by their early lives, before the massive changes they brought to society. You cannot make a society work, if your answer to boys in school is to medicate, and not worry about really teaching the fundamentals. You cannot make society work when you cannot see that 50% more of one gender in University is an issue, and you cannot expect people to sign onto a contract without consideration. This today, is what we are asking of young men, and of course many are making the choice to not sign up. Young women, will also suffer as a result, the boomers especially will suffer, as there will be fewer people to support them with care, producing goods they can buy with their pensions, funding their pensions, and of course buying their houses. However, boomers have yet to wake up to this.

    MGTOW, is a smart move for the individual male for now, and I suspect you are going to start to see it in increasing numbers, it will just be subtle, it will be those guys that "refuse to grow up" because well signing up to a deal that hurts not helps you, is not growing up, it is being stupid. However, change the deal, balance the risks, worry about educating my sons, worry about allowing boys to spend time with men and well that changes everything.

    Like · Reply · 4 August 2016 07:18









    Keith Robertson · Works at Geological Consulting
    Paolo Dolorosa Zero.

    Like · Reply · · 4 August 2016 08:25









    Paolo Dolorosa · Senior Engineer at Weyland-Yutani Corporation
    Malcolm Newall You say it requires rebalancing the rewards and penalties, but there are no rewards to rebalance.

    Again, what have I to gain from a conventional relationship with a woman? Like Keith says; nothing.

    I'll go one step futher, and say even if it did involve rewards, why the hell would I accept them if they were conditional with penalties? In fact why should I accept any kind of penlisation for choosing to enter a relationship?







    Ephesians 5 "Husbands, Love your wives like Christ loved the Church". (Wives, give your husbands something to love).
    "Wives, RESPECT your husbands". (Husbands, give your wives something to respect.)

    For a man does not truly feel loved unless his wife, mother, and children display respect to him.

    "From each MAN according to his abilty, to each WOMAN according to her need"... Allison Tienemann

    "Feminism is a HATE group... Feminists are HATEFUL people"... Mr. e

    "In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem."... Ronald Reagan

    Comment


    • #3
      when you enter in to the metal health or drug system in the UK there's usually a tick box in the risk section for 'are you male age '15-35' and im always chilled by the number of mental health workers who always ask 'well what's so special about young men?' and i tell them why that box is on there and they just skip past without a second thought, if this was a disease killing 78% of women that age it would have got a greater reaction than simply being ignored i know that
      "There's a time when the operation of the machine becomes so odious—makes you so sick at heart—that you can't take part. You can't even passively take part. And you've got to put your bodies upon the gears and upon the wheels, upon the levers, upon all the apparatus, and you've got to make it stop. And you've got to indicate to the people who run it, to the people who own it, that unless you're free, the machine will be prevented from working at all."
      Mario Savio

      "A single, seemingly powerless person who dares to cry out the word of truth
      and to stand behind it with all his person and all his life, ready to pay a
      high price, has, surprisingly, greater power, though formally disfranchised,
      than do thousands of anonymous voters."
      Vaclav Havel
      'if you want to know who rules you, look at who you're not allowed to criticise' Voltaire

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by theplummer View Post
        You don't need to validate yourself through being in relationships. You don't need to validate yourself through whether you're getting laid or not. You don't need to validate yourself through what car you drive, or what house you live in, or what job you have. Validate yourself through yourself. Validate yourself through your accomplishments and who you are as a person.
        "...but when she goes off you, she will not just walk away, she will walk away with your fucking skin in a jar." ~~ DoctorRandomercam
        "The laws of man, they don't apply when blood gets in a woman's eye" - The Black Keys

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by theplummer View Post
          Comment string saved for posterity... For I fear a deletion is imminent.
          As I often say, why is it that WOMEN seem to be the only ones who get to be the arbiters of our morality and ethics in society? How come a thing is only truly "right" or "wrong" when a *WOMAN* says it? Why aren't *MALE* values respected in our society?
          FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
          It's time to call it out for what it is.
          == REJECT FEMINISM. EMBRACE HUMANITY ==


          The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men
          http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by theplummer View Post
            You don't need to validate yourself through whether you're getting laid or not.

            I think a lot of men validate themselves by whether they're getting laid or not. And I think a lot of women validate men by whether they (the men) are getting laid or not.
            FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
            It's time to call it out for what it is.
            == REJECT FEMINISM. EMBRACE HUMANITY ==


            The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men
            http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

            Comment

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