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"Honor Killings" Not Always Muslim

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  • "Honor Killings" Not Always Muslim

    No, I am not going to post a link. The photo is beyond disgusting and horrible.

    On my Face here in Mexico came a photo which shows two legs and part of an arm sticking out of ashes, with her legs still burning. It is a 13 year old girl, or what is left of her. Her offense? She got pregnant (embarasada) by a sacerdote (Catholic Priest). So, a number of people in her community pounded the crap out of her, then tossed on gasoline, and burned her all to Hell.

    If someone really wants to see it, there is enough information to find it.

    The person who posted it said it happened in Mexico, but several commentors said, no, it was in Central America, I think Guatemala.

    A lot of commenters also asked when the priest burning was to take place.

    So, so-called honor killings are not totally Muslim.

    The police have the video the still came from, and hope to identify the people who did it. I cannot speak for Central America or Guatemala. But, if it happened in Mexico, I assure you the murderers will do hard time if caught. In 2015, they burned two innocent men in Ajalpa and they did get 8 years in prison.

  • #2
    Can't say I've got anything other than contempt for an pedo catholic priest (alleged, can't say I'd trust the evidentiary justice coming from this community)... But aren't these idiot commenters missing the point about getting the murderers who killed the child.

    Also 8 years for the immolation of two innocent men, seems a disgustingly derisory sentence. Why so lenient?
    "...especially when it comes to communication, it can be observed, if it is not a negotiation it's a war."
    Originally posted by menrppl2
    Can't live with em, life is great without them.


    • #3
      First, in Mexico, they do not use bogus names for things. Pedophilia is not having sex with pubescent girls in Mexico. Pedophilia is having sex with little kids.

      There were legal issues, but pedophilia is not the correct term.

      I don't think the commenters missed the point of the murderers. It was stated the police were seeking them.

      In that case, last year Mexico finally went to the criminal justice system used in most of the world. The adversarial system. Where the accused actually faces the judge (no jury) and can present a defense.

      The Ajalpa murders, and I do call them that, were a result of a massive breakdown in social order. An insane mob thought they were bringing justice and that the cops weren't doing their job, which was wrong, of course.

      The full sentence for the offense would normally be 20 years. probably man slaughter not cold blooded premeditated murder. The 8 years was a plea bargain thing, also new in Mexico. Since there were still stupid people who imagined the prosecutors had mistakenly misidentified the guilty, though they had videos of them, it does make sense they wanted them to admit guilt and they did.


      • #4
        Sometimes justice is more karma than anything else. Ajalpa was a market center, which people who have not lived in Mexico may not understand. A lot of goods moved through that town.

        Business is way down. People simply won't go to a town where a large number of the citizens chose to go crazy and kill someone with no evidence. So, the town folks are complaining their business is really going broke. Would ya' think?


        • #5
          Thx polite, clarifies somewhat.

          Mobs are disgusting, I've never liked that defence. Sat on a jury for a case where a mob of kids about a dozen cornered one member of a rival gang, he was partially blind, they held him down and gouged out his good eye with a smashed brandy bottle. Two were charged with the attack, the rest given a pass, the one who led the attack and did the gouging pled guilty and went straight to sentencing. The other charged who held the lad down, went to trial. During the trial he was a total dick, and when in the witness box, the judge had to tell him repeatedly to switch off his phone and put it away. In the jury, after a bunch of hot air, the other jurors decided they had to be lenient, he was a kid about 16 I think maybe 15 at the time of the attack. Because it was a gang attack they argued he was not responsible. The little shite didn't give a toss about the victim. These kids were not hardened gang runners in a shitty ghetto, they were kids off the rails cos their parents couldn't control them in an area with high unemployment but no stark poverty or drug violence. But those two little shits who thought it would be funny to blind the kid cos he was from a different kids gang, from the other end of the street, plain nasty pieces of work. Arguing a defence of mob behaviour. The blinded kid was the saddest thing I'd ever seen, poor lil soul, kept saying like a mantra, he had to take it like a man, that he was a soldier, had to defend his mates. Neighbourhood with very high rate of single parents, no surprise there, and kids deluded into feral maniacs. The mother of the kid in the dock, was one hard faced bitch, not hard to see where that kid got his arrogant sense of superiority and utter coldness towards others from.

          Though the story of the catholic priest, is that confirmed at all? Or is it something that just fits the dramatic narrative. Could she have gotten pregnant by another teenager? Did this thing play out on facts basically, or hearsay and gossip.
          "...especially when it comes to communication, it can be observed, if it is not a negotiation it's a war."
          Originally posted by menrppl2
          Can't live with em, life is great without them.


          • #6
            Mexican gangs are as fond of beheadings as their middle-eastern peasant cultural counterparts.

            Mexican's and middle eastern cultures share the same IQ range as a heritage as well. Both average in the mid to high 80's... which is the sweet spot for criminal behavior. Smart enough to plan and execute a crime, not smart enough to think long term or compete with higher IQ cultures.

            Honor killings is something most cultures tolerated up to about 200 years ago.. which is a grain of sand in the beach of human history. Honor killings of the weak... be that women but usually children.. by both men AND women. Being 'nice' to kids is a new concept. Your odds of being tossed into the nearest river by your mother as a newborn was in the double digits.

            Human brutality has been a constant, not the exception, but the rule, with a small exception in very recent history.

            Not all human cultures have moved on from that period... not all of them know how... and who knows if they can be taught or not. There is no way to effectively increase IQ from birth... nothing significant at this time... the only thing that is possible is to lower IQ by abusing a human in development.

            In the mean time.. I'd suggest cultures that value tolerance not import cultures that do not share that value.


            • #7
              Originally posted by Iggy View Post

              In the mean time.. I'd suggest cultures that value tolerance not import cultures that do not share that value.
              It sounds so simple doesn't it?
              I used to think collapse was inevitable. Now I realize it is necessary.

              It was only a matter of time before the bicycles realized that they in fact did not need the fish.


              • #8
                All IQ levels have their limitations.

                The average western citizen is smart enough to be civil, but still too dumb to understand the long-term implications of Eugenics or the limitations of "IQ" as a measuring tool for human worth.

                There are other considerations such as biodiversity, range of thought, having a plentiful stock of "hutu tribesman" genes that haven't gone thru centuries of Game-of-Thrones in a rigid European social environment.

                People who can think outside the fucking box and beat your "high tech" in flip flops and pajamas.

                IQ says Iraq should have been over 20 years ago, IQ says Afghanistan should have been quelled, IQ says white people of Europe shouldn't be going extinct, IQ says Vietnam should have been a pushover.

                Those are the limitations of valuing people by IQ.

                Many aspects of Mexican or Arab culture are worlds superior to your autistic Anglo-Nordic culture.

                Everything in life doesn't boil down to "less crime" and "more safety."


                • #9
                  IQ trends and predicts outcomes in health and wealth quite well, better than any other indicator, particularly when talking in groups.

                  But that does not imply you can use the tool to predict the outcome of individuals based on their race or gender or culture. A high IQ arabic female will likely (but not always) fare better than a low IQ asian male. IQ alone does not create worth... it only allows for varying degree's of potential.

                  And without more safety and less crime there is no real ability for life to improve. Crime creates poverty, and limits advancement because the investment is wasted or stolen.

                  The usefulness in using IQ averages for cultures is vital when deciding 'what to do'... or more specifically what NOT to do, or attempt, with particular cultures. Central planning types like to pretend everything is environmental, and use that flawed thinking to allow them to 'equalize' outcomes using violence for the 'greater good'. Only.. it does not work.. it only results in more unnecessary suffering.

                  Middle eastern IQ's have been dropping.. because the higher IQ born within their cultures are leaving to enjoy the benefits higher IQ cultures. Its a massive IQ drain on cultures, and Iraq and Afghanistan nations are still suffering from massive amounts of violence compared to most anywhere else on earth.

                  The outcome of wars... well that is not what IQ predicts. IQ provides a measure of potential, and surviving an invasion is not exactly something that requires a high level of IQ to achieve. It certainly helps, but that does not demand a high level of IQ to accomplish.

                  As for Europe.. IQ does not make you immune to propaganda. IQ does not make you more moral or less. IQ is simply a measure of general intelligence and the ability of complex though and actions.

                  In regards to superior cultures.. Indoor plumbing is superior to shitting on the street. Innocent till proven guilty is superior to mob justice. These are not 'Anglo' specific inventions... they are collaborations between all high IQ people working WITHIN the framework of a voluntary-based, property rights culture... aka... Western Culture. There is no place where western culture has not significantly improved the quality of life of those who have used it.. be that life span, lowered violence, lower birth deaths, etc.

                  A premise of western culture is that the best ideas are best.. not because they come from a white person, but because they scientifically work and produce results that others voluntarily desire and are willing to trade for.

                  IQ limitations might limit what services you can offer in trade, however the incentive for the higher IQ people is to create solutions that appeal to the broadest audience. Smart phones... crazy complex devices made easy to use by super smart people.

                  Its hard to argue against the superiority of western culture.. the 'process' of the culture.. while using the superior communication tools created by that culture to make your argument. Its self-contradictory.

                  And limitations are a part of nature.. and a part of competition.. and its those who pretend that there are NO limitations that are in danger of enacting bad ideas in an attempt to 'correct' them.

                  Planet earth is one big Eugenics system.. always has been... be that via the conscious efforts of some of her inhabitants or the random mutation of their DNA from time to time. Most of us are descendants of slaves / serfs... breed like cattle for our ability to comply with the orders of our masters, who would change from time to time. Eugenics is still happening, we just call it state education or income redistribution... its just rebranded to keep the tax cattle from suffering too much anxiety and keep their productivity levels high.

                  The effects of IQ is certainly known by those who are pulling the strings today.. its the tax cattle that still haven't quite caught on yet. If you can mobilize a low IQ a mob to keep the mid range IQ tax cattle seeking the protection of the 'farmers', you don't need to invest as much into fences.

                  This is an old game... its disguised and rebranded and obfuscated.. but it's the same old game our great great grand parents had to navigate through. They managed.. we can to.


                  • #10
                    I can think of 100 ways Anglo culture is inferior, not the least of which are the reasons we're on this site but also including scalability, sustainability, loss of well-being from standardized 40-hour workweek, capitalism leads to feminism to get productivity out of the other %50 of the population, and then the entire continent slides into a tub of shit when their birthrates tank, and then they blame it on everybody else for not having the same "race to the bottom" short-sighted autism.

                    We can point to the last 100 years or simply look out the window to see the failure of Western culture.

                    We can look at Japan which was once a thriving culture, now most of the young men lock themselves in their rooms watching anime.

                    You can blame it on "propaganda" all you want, the joos are in no danger of becoming extinct, they also have higher IQ's in general and put a great deal of emphasis on community over self, whereas European cultures put the self as the highest aspiration, and the availability of cheap plastic crap at Walmart as the highest good.

                    Deny and spin it all you want, the only way for the west to survive is to become a Judeo-Christian copy of Islam by curtailing its own culture and freedoms.

                    Supposedly intelligent people pounding the drum of "safety, safety, safety" when fewer people die from terrorism than any number of things with easy cures.

                    As usual it's the supersized ego of "vee are superior" Anglos driving them to bankrupt themselves fighting multiple wars, crappy high-tech fighters like using a laser to hunt wabbits, instead of using common sense solutions they send a $10 million missile to destroy a $10 tent.

                    These are the braniacs that are supposedly going to teach the world how to live.

                    People in the third-world may not have toilets, but they know that crap is fertilizer and also a renewable source of fuel.

                    They also don't use $200 million planes to hunt wabbit.

                    They also aren't going extinct.

                    They also don't treat their menfolk like shit.

                    They also don't put the #1 priority in life on plastic bullshit from China.

                    They also have more free time, pay less taxes, their women are nicer and more feminine, their countries more lush and green, their food more organic, their governments smaller and more humble, and they also don't have humongous California-size egos putting their own people with birth defects into death camps.

                    You're correct that the world is one big natural eugenics called "survival of the fittest."

                    And guess what. Nature called. Europeans weren't the fittest.

                    So smarten up, lose the ego, realize you have something to learn from other cultures, you're not the master race, IQ isn't the be-all-end-all, and Europe isn't always right, in fact it's usually wrong.


                    • #11
                      Dubs, I'm not sure what you are on about. Conflating raw cognitive ability with other cultural factors is mixing apples and oranges. Just because IQ is not the only factor that determines an individual or cultures survivability doesn't mean it isn't a valid indicator. IQ is absolutely a valid indicator. So are all the other indicators you mention.
                      I used to think collapse was inevitable. Now I realize it is necessary.

                      It was only a matter of time before the bicycles realized that they in fact did not need the fish.


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by polite_disagreement View Post
                        So, so-called honor killings are not totally Muslim.
                        All cultures have had them at some time. The secular West outgrew that, what, 200 years ago?
                        Other places such stuff still goes on. And it's fully rational, in a violent society. First line of defence.

                        But lest we forget:
                        Let me remind you that the reason "honor killings" get a mention at all, is that sometimes women, too, are victims.

                        And curiously, those are the only victims who get in the news, such that people think "honor killings" = "Pakistani husband killing wife".

                        All part of the pattern.



                        • #13
                          Interesting viewpoint with a lot of good points. But, the reason the West is going bust is not anything i.q. or genetically related. it is because all great civilizations inevitably give women the right to vote, and their incessant demands for more benefits and protections to the detriment of men, who are still today paying the bills for everyone, destroy the entire society.

                          The only question is for how long will the light be out this time?


                          • #14
                            Not all honor killings are similar, just like not all homicides are the same, or any other crime for that matter.

                            Some honor killings may seem more horrible than others, such as the case mentioned here since it involves a child, others might seem "less horrid" for some crazy reason, such as the case you mentioned about killing unfaithful wives. They are all considered honor killings though, which by definition are the murder of a relative - mostly female - due to their committing actions that are considered shameful.

                            Honor killings are not a Muslim practice, nor is it a Christian one, Jewish, or any other religion, which is why I initially described it as tribal. It is a tribal act committed by different people of different religions due to having stronger affiliations with the tribe and/or private community than that with the state.

                            Some tribes in India have actually obtained the approval of the state to govern themselves according to their own inner laws, and the state usually gives in due to the scarcity of law enforcement officers and/or prevalent corruption.

                            Under Abrahamic religions, crimes of adultery are punishable by death for both males and females. This is different from honor killings, and the example you set forth in which only wives were killed due to committing adultery. What makes honor killings different from religious prosecution is that the latter is applied against all perpetrators as well as has a set of terms that need to be met in order for the crime to be punishable, such as sanity, lack of force, witnesses, etc.

                            There's no correlation between IQ and such practices, otherwise every nation that ever committed crimes would be dumbass as hell, and that would definitely include all people. Indian folks are one of the smartest people on the planet judging by their scientific contributions to the world, but they too have tribes and actions that clearly indicate a loyalty and sense of belonging to the tribe more than that to the state. The same goes for countries such as Pakistan, the nomadic part of Syria, and many others whose states have failed in attaining submission to the law, which the majority of the population abides by btw.

                            The information is out there, but you may choose to hold onto your own misconceptions if you want.


                            • #15
                              India: IQ 82 average, and only really made progress after the Colonialism, as was the case for many other cultures. I wouldn't be surprised if there are sub-sects of Indian heritages that had higher IQ's than others, similar to the IQ variance that differs significantly between Jewish Tribal factions.

                              And low IQ does not equate to more crime.. nor does poverty equate to more crime... its not that simple, but there is a 'band' where those who are more prone to use violence to gain resources tend to gather... between 85 and 90.

                              Indeed honor killings are tribal in origin, as is slavery and rampant child abuse... religious loyalties tend to supersede the tribal loyalties so that civilizations can form. However some religions and cultures held onto the concepts of honor killings... as we see demonstrated here. IQ is not the only factor, but it is a predictive tool.

                              In regards to birth rates... while higher IQ cultures have definitely dropped down to critical levels... places like South Africa has experience completely unseen levels of population growth of their black populations. The total population in South Africa was estimated at 55.9 million people in 2016, according to the latest census figures. Looking back, in the year of 1960, South Africa had a population of 17.4 million people. That is an astoundingly high rate of change, that came from western medicines and health practices. Now that South Africa is abandoning western values, the infrastructure is failing and violent crime is on the rise.

                              Safety and security has nothing to do with the state, but is does require an agreement as to some basic rules... contract law, ownership and property rights.. without these tools the people will not invest due to the risk or theft.

                              Race and IQ is still relatively untaught.. I doubt anyone here was exposed to this information via their state schooling or post-secondary socialist academic professors. This knowledge has been secluded by those who used to control the media... but not longer entirely. The concept of colonization was that you could teach the indigenous how to farm, or become engineers, at the same level as the colonizers by improving their environment and education. And it worked.. but not in all cultures. Japan, Korea, China (eventually)... all these cultures where their innate IQ's were on par or higher than the colonizers took root and they have dramatically improved the living standards.

                              However, other places... these concepts don't take root... sub 90 cultures have yet to be able to hold onto the benefits once they purge the higher IQ people and they tend to resort back to tribalism.

                              The proof is in the immigration patterns... but the problem is also in those same patterns. Mixing cultures with disparate IQ's AND concepts of property rights (or lack there-of) is adding a whole lot of unnecessary suffering to both the hosts and the migrants. The birth rate of low IQ cultures is significantly higher.. and there is simply no way for any western culture to be able to absorb the needs of the billion or so potential migrants that are actively seeking to live in western nations.

                              In other words.. this is not something we can fix by trying to mix everything together.. that will simply kill the host. Its also something that states cannot 'cure'.. and for the most parts state governments are entirely doing against the will of a good portion of their population tax cattle. The financial burden is being put on westerners.. who cannot afford to have more kids and maintain their standard of living.

                              This is a state-created problem generated by a state-proposed solution based off some really... really bad ideas and an active disregard for the science of human biodiversity. State's don't solve problems, they only pretend to.

                              I wish IQ differences did not exist to the extent they do.. I wish it was not racial.. I wish there was a way to fix it with nutrition or education... but there is not, at least not yet. However pretending it is not the case is to base solutions on bad foundations that are certain to cause more suffering of everyone but a select few, who have armies to protect them.

                              High IQ is not the enemy, it is most likely going to be a big part of the solution... but only if we stop lying to ourselves about things that are deemed unfair.